5 Systems Every Rookie Investor Needs for Faster Rehabs and Bigger Profits

Ashley:Ever thought about flipping houses or running a rehab project that felt maybe way more chaotic than you expected? This episode is for you. Today we’re talking about how building real systems can completely change not just your rehab, but your life outside the business too.

Toni:Yeah, because success isn’t just about finding good deals. It’s about how you run the project once you’re under contract. And today we’re breaking down how Serena Norris built repeatable processes, how she creates scopes of work and estimates rehabs and the exact tools she uses to keep her flips organized and most importantly, keep them profitable.

Ashley:This is the Real See Rookie Podcast. I’m Ashley Kehr.

Toni:And I’m Toni J. Robinson. And for the third time, we got a three-peat happening for the Real Estate Rookie podcast. Serena, welcome back. Appreciate you coming on.

Serena:Thanks so much for having me guys. Good to see you again.

Ashley:Serena, for those listening that maybe didn’t listen to the previous episodes, can you give us a little background on your real estate investing experience?

Serena:Absolutely. So I got into real estate in 2015. I knew that I wanted to go the investment route. I didn’t know where to start, so I was currently trying to get my license online, which I did. And I ended up meeting my mentor two days after I moved back to Washington State and he just mentioned he was flipping and I was like, “That’s exactly what I want to do. Where do I show up?” So I started flipping with him in 2015, got thrown into high volume early. He was doing 22 active flips at a time. And we honestly didn’t have really any systems. It was complete chaos. But over the last 10 years, or going into 11, we’ve done over 130 flips together, about a $55 million worth of volume. We have a portfolio, mostly long-term rentals, mostly single family, some retail commercial, and also have short-term rentals.So my role in everything was the construction management, the operating systems, all the finishes and the design for the flips. And I’m also a licensed broker, so I sold a lot of the flips on the backend. And yeah, over my course of my time, I just learned how to turn that chaos into repeatable systems. And today I focus on helping investors run flips like a business instead of that chaos and constant emergency. Yeah.

Toni:I think everyone, flipping is probably the type of real estate investing that a lot of folks are familiar with because HGTV and all the TV shows and people who become celebrities flipping homes. Even our own James Daynard is now a TV celebrity because he’s flipping homes. But I think the people underestimate what really goes into or how chaotic flipping a home and running a renovation, even if we’re not flipping, just a renovation in general can be. So just maybe paint the picture for us, Serena, before you had the right systems in place. When we talk about flip number one or flip number two, what did your day-to-day life actually look like trying to manage all of these rehab projects?

Serena:Yeah, absolutely. I mean, before we had the systems, it was total chaos. I mean, we were juggling so many projects at once. We didn’t have any repeatable systems from project to project. So each project felt like it was starting over from scratch. When I was working with my mentor, I was just learning everything, but a lot of times he was also in peer chaos. So I was just trying to organize as much information as possible. And when I started seeing patterns, that’s when I was really starting to just organize everything and collect all that information. So I have saved time where I can reference things. The other thing was that I just felt like we were making decisions all day long. I mean, it felt like constant texts and calls from contractors. We were absolutely needed to move the project forward. If we didn’t respond, then the project stalled.And because we didn’t have templates to reference or we hadn’t built that organization system, we missed a lot of scope items. We had late budget surprises, like change orders mid-project or even after the project was done. Didn’t fully understand the true costs until the very end. And of course that ate into all of our profit. Even though we were successful, we were making money on the projects. We definitely didn’t … Yeah. We were losing out for sure. And mentally, it was just exhausting. It always felt like we’re behind. The biggest issue was that we were the system. And so if we forgot something, it just didn’t exist. So a lot of times we would think a contractor is being inefficient, but really it was us. We were the bottleneck, not the contractor.

Ashley:I can imagine this would lead to a lot of miscommunication too, or especially having multiple people involved and relying on text and phone calls and things like that to communicate. It could be one person said one thing and the other person said, or no proof that you even picked that tile instead of another tile. So how did your life change once you started to actually implement the right systems? And not even on the business side, but I’m sure this impacted your personal life too.

Serena:Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. I mean, going back to what you said, my biggest role throughout all of this, especially when contractors are like, “Well, I knew that. ” I’d be like, “I don’t assume anything because there can be so many miscommunications on job sites and my goal is to eliminate all of that and create as much clarity as possible for all parties involved.” So yeah, once I started building repeatables processes, one of the first noticeable change was mental clarity, confidence that we had on the execution, also confidence we had in contractors and contractors having confidence in us as well. And we started trying to answer as many decisions as possible in the planning phase, not in the execution phase. There will always be problems arise that you didn’t plan for, but if we can be more proactive instead of reactive, that saves so much time and headache and it saves a lot of money.So it also built a lot of trust between us and the contractors. A lot of flippers, especially in the beginning, they see contractors as an obstacle that they need to overcome to get the house from to ARV.And what we learned is they are an external team that we need to value so well. So trust between them is extremely important. So the more organized we are, the more organized and more trust that they can have with us, and then they want to work with us more and give us good pricing. I was able to actually get some freedom. A lot of people get into flipping because they want financial freedom. The real freedom in flipping is having time, control over your time and your energy. So flipping is 100% an active income source and the goal is to systemize and streamline it as much as possible to have more control over your time and energy. So I got to a point where instead of working seven days a week, I’m traveling two or three times a month, sometimes spending months out of the country at a time because my systems are working for me.And yeah, I stopped carrying everything in my head so that way people could execute without me.

Toni:Yeah. And Serena, we spent some time together walking some of your projects just a few years ago and just the way that you had everything. So it was like everything was at the tip of your tongue and you knew where everything was. And that’s something that happens with having the right systems and just being able to fall back on those. So I’ve seen it in action and it’s pretty impressive to see up close. But I guess let’s zoom out maybe a little bit for our rookie listeners. Just walk us through the full lifecycle on one of your flips. If we go from acquisition to sale, what are some of those systems that show up at the various stages across the starting point to the finish line?

Serena:Yeah, absolutely. I always think about this in there’s five core systems that every flipping business needs. So you have your information systems, which are really the foundation. So file storage, where you organize the information and have that as standardized as possible. Then you have your planning systems and then your execution systems, communication systems, and quality control systems. So within the planning system, that incorporates your acquisition and your post-acquisition planning. So with acquisition systems specifically, that’s really like checklists for me. That’s going to be, did I pull my comps? Have I reviewed my title? Have I gotten a sewer scope? We didn’t get sewer scopes in the beginning for a long time. And then we had a surprise 5K bill at the end. What is our strategy? And so acquisition system is a lot of gathering that information in a centralized place to be able to figure out our strategy as much as possible to take that into our planning.Now, once we know we’re going to buy the property, the planning starts as soon as possible. And that is the most important part of your flipping process. If a lot of people, especially a lot of newer and people to flipping and beginners, they will oftentimes skip over that process because they don’t feel comfortable or feel like they know enough to plan well, but with poor planning comes poor execution. And a lot of times if you’re already executing without the right plan, you’re already in a reactive mode, you’re already probably on the chance of losing money and effectively managing your time. So with the planning system within that, I always have probably the most important piece for every flip is a very detailed scope of work and having that tied to your budget so you know what your projected numbers are going to be for that project.I also in the planning, so I have my scope of work and I have my budget. I have my design and finish packet. So I have chosen all of the design materials for that job and put in all of the details of even how to install it, grout color, everything. And then my floor plans. Even on simple projects, I loved having floor plans because they are an opportunity to have a centralized piece that everyone can reference and take you out of the equation. So little details like how high to hang chandeliers from the floor, how to put vanity lights. All of these questions that I’ve gotten over the years from contractors, I don’t want to answer again. That’s the key. It’s not that you’re never going to have problems. It’s that I don’t want any new problems. So having to be able to put all of those details into the floor plan and the scope of work, depending on where it should live is important.Execution systems. So absolute need task management software to keep all of your internal tasks organized. And so that way you can track contractor scheduling, milestones for different quality control checkpoints. If you need a home inspection for permit inspections, how you keep all of that task. And then also when you’re ready to hire an assistant or someone on your internal team, that’s your place of communication and coordination. Communication systems, figure out how the cadence between how you want to communicate with you and the contractor or you and your internal team. And then last but not least, which is the cherry on top, is quality control. So again, like checkpoints at each milestone, I have probably about, I think like five or six quality control checklists. And at any given point during the project, my goal is that the sooner I can correct a quality control item, the least expensive it’s going to be for me.So the result of that is like fewer surprises, faster decisions, or taking me out of the equation to even make the decision and flip stop being as chaotic, business becomes more scalable and the best thing is repeatable.

Toni:I guess two follow-up questions to that. First, I love the idea of having the different systems and what we need to plug into our business, but I also can imagine that there are maybe Ricky investors who are listening that might feel overwhelmed at the thought of putting all of these systems together. So a two-part question. The first part is, which one would you focus on first and why? And then once you’ve decided on which one to focus on first, how do you know how far to take it before starting to focus on the other ones? Do I need to get it 100% everything’s dialed in or can I take it a certain percentage? So where to focus first, then how deep do you go on that one once you’ve decided?

Serena:First absolute system that everyone should apply right now and it’s super easy is your filing system. The information systems that you have are the foundation to all of this because if you have your information in a million different places, you have bids and emails, you have just all of your files not organized per project or even not in certain files or folders within your project folder, right? It creates chaos. I can’t tell you how much time I wasted trying to find some piece of information or just a picture that a contractor needed, but because I wasn’t organized, it took me forever. And so setting up a file system, we would do folder for each project within that project, it’s standardized the same folders. We have our analysis, we have our purchase docs, we have our rehab, and we have our rehab pictures, and then we’ll have our listing folder as well.And that’s the same folder system for every single project. And within that, it’s just so standardized filing system to start buying that information. That’s super simple. I’d say to answer your question, like how far to go, okay, think of it like this. A lot of people will come to me and they’re like, “I have no systems.” And I said, “Well, have you already done a few flips?” And they say, “Yes.” And I go, “Well, you already have systems. Every process that you are processing on each of your houses makes up a system. Now is it an effective system?” That’s what you have to ask yourself and revise over time. So if you are going to even your first flip and think about how do I want to process this right now or you did one flip before and go, “Okay, this was my process. This is what I did.Here’s where it didn’t work. Here’s where I think I should refine it and then try that on the next flip.” And honestly, that’s what I did. And I built it over time, always coming back to the same mindset of like, how do I standardize this where I’m not doing a different project and starting from scratch from each project? How can I take from the last project, apply it to this project, and then make it unique to that specific project? I hope that answers that question.

Ashley:We have to take a short break, but when we come back, we will get into creating your scope of work and running your rehab project in an efficient and repeatable process. We’ll be right back. Okay, welcome back. So we are here with Serena. So Serena, once the property is under contract, how do you organize the rehab before you’ve even closed on the property so nothing slips through the cracks?

Serena:Over time, so over projects, I’ve created a super extensive scope of work and budget template. So I essentially have been … Anything that we’ve ever done to a project will go into that scope of work template, it becomes organized. So that way I’m just working off of a scope of work template where I’m just deleting what I don’t need instead of having to think to add what I do need.

Ashley:Serena, is this in Google Sheets, in a project management software? Where does this template live?

Serena:Yeah. So I used to use Smartsheets and now I’ve rebuilt everything into Google Sheets to be an all- in-one. We were using Asana, Smartsheets and other platforms, and I rebuild it all in Google Sheets. You just need a sheets, some sort of Excel platform to use this. And so the structure of that template is you’ll have your item, your line item, and then the most important part is you’ll have your description, line item description. And what that defines is what needs to happen with that line item. I also describe the outcome of that item. I specify what is included in that line item. So if it’s materials and/or labor or both, and then I’ll put a quantity by it, hopefully to give me out some numbers, some costs associated with it. But most important part is the description column. And the reason why is, and before, when we used to just do our scope of works on Word documents, like literally bullet point, it would be like a one-page bullet point, walk with the contractor.So you get it? Cool. See what I see?

Ashley:Well, Serena, I have a question on the line item. So in this template, how are you breaking it down? Are you going room by room? So it’s like the kitchen, this is the cabinet, or are you doing it by the trade? So here’s the plumbing section, here’s everything we’re doing for the plumbing.

Serena:I do it by trade, 100%. I do not suggest doing room by room. The reason why is because I want to be able to put a quantity next to each one and have it one place. I also want to have it in the format of the way that contractors think. So if you’re comfortable going through room by room and that’s comfortable when you are on the property to make notes, but when you go back, I highly suggest putting it in a format where you’re going trade by trade. And so I have it in three main categories. You have your initial services, which are going to be getting the property clean to even start construction. We have initial landscaping, we have re-key, trash out, demo, making it like a clean slate so contractors can go in and work. Then I have all of my exterior and then I have all of my interior.And then for all of the line items within there, each category, they are separated out by trade. So I have all my plumbing. I might separate out plumbing and then plumbing fixtures, but plumbing is all together. And then the line items within there are actually what’s happening. So like plumbing install. And then my description is everything that comes with that. And back of the day, what we used to do, for example, with drywall, that one bullet point would just be repair drywall. That would be the only information we’re giving to the contractor. And then he’d give us some number back based on filling in the gaps and assumption he had and then he would execute and then we would end up surprised why he didn’t do it to the level that we were thinking of. And so what we learned is that that extra description in there, instead of just saying repair drywall, we are describing the outcome we want, right?Repair drywall throughout the whole entire house to make the walls smooth and blend in. We want them to match the texture with existing, or if it’s like install a new drywall, we’re detailing what level of finish that we want it. Or if you don’t know the level of finish for it, then describe extremely fine texture or smooth wall, no texture at all and then include materials. I like to split that up into two different categories. Is it design material, like a finished material or installation materials and then labor? Who’s responsible for that? So once that line item’s complete, I always think about that is your contractual language. If you took it in front of, say there was a dispute and you took it in front of Judge Judy, who would she side with? I want it to make it where there’s absolutely no question about what needed to be executed.And not only does that create apples to apples, eliminates any sort of ambiguity or assumptions, but then it takes me out of the equation. They know exactly what to do. They don’t have to ask me another question about it and eliminates surprise change orders on the backend as well if it didn’t meet my expectation. So going line by line, making sure that all of those details are covered. And luckily, I know beginners are asking, “I don’t even know how to fill in that information.” We live in probably the most easiest time we’ve ever lived in order to learn and gain information. Use those tools, use ChatGPT and AI to help you with this, Google and ChatGPT can even give you a framework, a checklist to go through. And when you’re walking a property, it’ll give you like, look at the fascia. Well, what’s the fascia?Google what the fascia is. These projects are your opportunity to learn. And I suggest creating a scope of work to the best of your ability up to about 85% and then start walking with contractors and just ask them to help you fill in the rest of the 15%, get clarity on them, ask them what they suggest. Contractors love to talk about what they know, right? So leverage that. Also, you can hire a home inspector. They don’t know everything about construction, but they’ll at least tell you what to look for, what buyers are going to care about on the backend as well. We used to pay a few hundred bucks to walk the property with us and don’t need a report or anything. Just point out what is going to be a defect or what I should look at. And that helps you put all of the pieces together and then you can start getting pricing.

Toni:Serena, when it comes to contractors, and you mentioned kind of relying on them a lot during this process, should a rookie investor, if they’ve never done a rehab before, should a rookie investor be working with a general contractor first or would it make more sense for them to go directly to the subcontractors, like the actual trades people, the plumbers, the electrician, the folks doing painting and drywall and the millwork, or would it make more sense to work directly with a general contractor as a rookie?

Serena:Yeah. I would say just to give some background on how where I ended up was I would pretty much only hire a general contractor for about 30 to 40% of the scope of work and the rest that I would sub out. One of the reasons why we need to do that was our market just to keep costs lower, but there is some learning curve because you have to understand the coordination between all of the subs and the GCs who are hiring all of those subs, they fill in all of those gaps for the trades where the electrician stops and the plumber starts, for example, for certain things. So to answer your question, in the beginning, absolutely go the GC route. And when you are analyzing, you might need to add a percent, 10, 15% on top to when you’re analyzing deals, just because GCs are going to be a bit more expensive, but they’re going to help you do a lot of that coordination and you can also learn how to manage a job site from them in the process.I would say though, vendors that you should always go directly to from day one, find a cabinet and countertop vendor and stay in control of that process the entire time.

Toni:So that actually leads into my next question, Serena, is you said you’ll use the GC today for like roughly 30% of your overall scope of work. How should a Ricky’s, as they start to maybe mature, how should they make the determination of when to use the GC versus when to just sub it out? You mentioned cabinets is one example, but just what is your decision making process to say, keep this with the general contractor or sub this out to someone else?

Serena:I would say if … Okay, maybe it helps to explain what that 30% that I’ll always use a GC for is. So that’s typically more on the finish stage of the house where there’s a lot of overlapping processes when it comes to millwork and doors install and paint and flooring, and where that would be really technical for me to figure out how to schedule all of those contractors. And again, I am not a contractor and I don’t want to become a contractor because I’m a real estate investor. And so if it’s too technical and overlapping and I don’t understand the process to it, then I will rely on hiring out a GC to coordinate all of that. Now, in the beginning of the project, when I started getting more comfortable of hiring electricians directly and then just communicating with the general contractor if they’re already on a job, “Hey, I’m going to be coordinating the electrician, can you let me know when you are ready for electrical rough-in?Can you let me know when you’re ready for electrical trim out? ” And typically I only needed to schedule them twice and I felt confident enough in, to my dog’s crane, confident enough in their scope and coordinating them that I could take that away because GCs, they will add about a margin on top, 10, 15, 30% of that subcontractor bid just to coordinate them. And so you’ll want to eliminate certain times, but it still needed to work within my system. So if it was simple, the coordination was simple, it was easy and it didn’t take up too much of my time and I understood their scope, then that’s when I would start taking it over.

Ashley:Now you said you might mark it up for a GC because they pay a percentage or cost a percentage of whatever the overall budget is usually, but what about, do you add any buffers or contingencies when you are estimating the cost of this rehab?

Serena:Yeah, especially in today’s market, please add in a rehab contingency. Right now, labor pricing and material pricing are really variable. And what was nice from 2015, well, 2017 to 2021 is in most markets, they were really hot. So we’re getting multiple offers, typically getting offers that are over list price. And so if we ended up going over budget and in part during the rehab, we’d be saved on that backend. But in most markets right now, It’s not as hot. You might get list price, you might get below list price, and you might be offering buyers a seller concession as well. And so you need to have your rehab budget as accurate as possible. And especially if you’re newer, that’s going to be hard for you to do. And so I would definitely add a contingency on top of that. And you know what? If the project doesn’t pencil with those numbers, then it doesn’t pencil and move on because you need to protect yourself with it.

Toni:And you mentioned margin and your initial budget, but once the rehab starts, I think this is where a lot of rookies kind of get punched in the face where they’re like, “I’m going to budget $2,700 for this full gut rehab.” And it ends up costing 10X that amount or 5X that amount, whatever it is. But how do you make sure that once the rehab starts, assuming that you had a good budget to begin with, how do you track your actual cost against your budget to make sure you’re not having any cost overruns?

Serena:Yeah. So I have my scope of work organized in a way where when I get a bill, I can see what those costs and actually excluding that scope of work and what that bill actually ties to. So I’m comparing apples to apples where, okay, here’s my scope for all of the electrical that I need to do. I need to do a full rewire or I just need to change out these outlets or just move a few lets. That’s all in one place within my scope of work. So when I get the bill from the electrician, I can cross reference those are. And over time I developed a cost tracking sheet that puts the costs where what I’ve projected, what I’ve have bid and what I’ve actually paid out, and it all balances like a checkbook and then lets me know at any given time during the project where I am projected to hit my budget.For a long time, we didn’t have that. A long time, it was random bills coming in. They don’t match the scope. We couldn’t track anything until it was near almost the end of the project or after the projects ended and were paid everything out. At that point, we don’t have any control to pivot or bring back any costs. So my goal is that at any given time during a project, I know what my projected numbers are going to be. So if I need to choose a tile that’s a little bit less expensive on the backend or maybe choose a task that I know I can DIY, like Nate once had to do a short fence or something just to save up some money, put on his work belt and build his fence so we can stay within budget. You can actually make that decision at that time.So yeah.

Toni:So it sounds like the biggest mistake is that a lot of times folks are a little too retroactive in comparing their actual expenses against their budget, but doing it in real time gives you the ability to kind of stop, pause, reassess, and make changes as needed. Now, I want to get into, Serena, the actual tools, the software that you’re using to operate all of these systems and keep your flips profitable. And we’ll cover that right after a short break to your word from today’s show sponsors. All right, welcome back. We were here with Serena and she just talked through the systems that every rehabber and flipper should have, how to stay on budget. But I want to talk a little bit more about some of the tools and the software. So when you think about running your rehab projects, you’re running your flips as a business, what specific software are you using?You already mentioned Google Sheets, but what else are you using on a daily basis to stay organized?

Serena:Yeah. So I used to use a bunch of different platforms and that worked for a while, but my dream was to have it more in an all- in-one place. So you were going to need a file storage. So whether Dropbox or Google Drive, we use Dropbox because Google Drive didn’t even exist back in the day when we started. And so file system, then you need a Excel-based system. So Smartsheets, Google Sheets, or Excel. I don’t suggest Excel because you really want it to be able to update in real time, especially when you start adding different team members. And then you have to your task management software. So we use Asana. I know Ashley used Monday.com. That’s going to be your task management. Use Podio for acquisitions. I know there’s so many options out there now for that, for acquisition pipeline and CRM. But honestly, I rebuilt my Smartsheets and my Asana to be all in one into Google Sheets now.So that’s what I operate within. So that way I just have one master Google Sheet for each project that has like 10 or 11 tabs. And that’s my centralized information, my project hub that I use.

Ashley:So now that you have a place to organize documents like your scope of work, invoice permits, photos and contracts, that’s all in Dropbox. How are you kind of now connecting these systems? So connecting your Google Sheets to your Google Drive, to your Dropbox, to your task management software. Can you maybe give us an example of maybe one little process and how it all implements and integrates together?

Serena:Yeah, absolutely. So now actually instead of Dropbox, I’m going to use Google Drive because now I have the Google Sheets, so it’s all within my Google, but then I can easily link them to each other. And oh, another system that I wanted to mention is that I use Chief Home Design Pro for floor plans. It’s pretty easy to use and it’s super capable. You could build a whole house with it, but I use it for, probably use 2% of what it’s capable of to do the floor plans. And so yeah, to tie in them all together, of course, and within your Google Drive, each folder, you’re going to have links to all of your Google sheets as well. But yeah, I keep all of my files, all of the contractor estimates within the drive, once I’m done with the floor plans, I’m exporting them into a PDF all on the drive.I very clearly highlight which ones are finals, which ones might be old drafts. I’d archive those. So that way your filing system is really organized that imagine if anyone went in and tried to find something that didn’t fully know or wasn’t onboarded, they’d be able to find it. And building it all in one hub as well, help just organize that information in one place. And so I don’t even really need to link it anywhere. It’s all together.

Toni:Serena, I think obviously we’ve covered a lot here on what Ricky should be focusing on. And like I mentioned at the top of the show, I’ve walked your project with you. I’ve seen how dialed in everything is. And I appreciate you sharing early on how that was an iterative process for you. Didn’t start off that way, but with each subsequent deal, it got a little bit better. But what piece of advice do you have for the Ricky listener who has no idea where to start when it comes to even potentially estimating the rehab and what that process looks like?

Serena:Non-negotiables, what you need in order to execute a project is a scope of work and you need your design and finish information. I like to keep them separate because again, I’m thinking about standardization. So my scope of work that I’m going to be … You build from day one is your launchpad for a scope of work template that you should be using for each project and you just delete what you don’t need customized to that specific project or add in and you keep adding. And so your scope of work, the design elements are typically going to be different per each project. That’s why I like to keep them separate and then your task management. And that’s really a progressive list of everything that you need to do and putting dates next to it. So those are really the three aim pillars that you need for each project.And so for the scope of work, if you don’t know even where to start, what I suggest is hiring a home inspector to walk with you on the property and identify actual defects to the house, stuff that would come up with a buyer’s inspection after you’re done, and start making note of all of that. I’d look at the comps and look at your subject house now and say, “What needs to change between my subject house to these comps that I’m trying to get the ARV? What’s the difference? I need to describe that. ” Then you’re going to put it into by trade. And like I said, we live in the best time to have resources for information. So I definitely highly suggest utilizing AI to help you through this, help you organize it, and then put it into an Excel sheet, and then even give it the questions, like give it a prompt like, “For this line item, can you help me describe what the outcome should be, what the level of finish could be, and then decide should I have materials included or is this labor only?” And then once that’s built for that one project, duplicate that for the next and then work off of that so you’re not making everything from scratch.And same thing for the task management schedule. Use ChatGPT. “Hey, for a fix and flip, can you give me a schedule outline for everything with a flip?” And that will give you a place to start, at least to reference. And then you can customize what works better, best for your process.

Ashley:Well, Serena, thank you so much. This is one of the biggest questions we get is how to run a rehab project, how to management, how to build out your scope of work. So thank you so much for giving us this little mini masterclass on getting organized and being able to be efficient and successful at running a rehab at your project, whether it’s a BER or you’re doing a flip. So where can people reach out to you and find out more information?

Serena:Yeah, absolutely. So I am going to be doing a lot of education over on Instagram. You can follow me at systemstack.io. If you want to learn about construction management, rehab execution, how to systemize working with contractors, that’s going to be the place to go to find me. My personal is also @serenanorris_ And also, if this conversation really resonated with you and you want to go deeper into how to actually run flips like a business, I’m now sharing the exact system that I’ve built over the last 10 years. It’s now available to the public. So go over to @systemstack.io or systemstack.io.com and to learn more.

Ashley:Well, thank you so much. We really appreciated you taking the time to share your experience with everyone. For everyone listening, make sure you subscribe to Real Estate Rookie on YouTube and that you’re following us on Instagram @biggerpocketsrookie. I’m Ashley, he’s Tony, and we’ll see you guys on the next episode.